When I was thinking about my subjects of interview, Sonam was actually the first one that came into my mind. Jointed a India monastery when he was 14, Sonam has been a monk and practicing Tibetan Buddhism for more than 20 years. Currently, he is studying science, especially biology and neuroscience at Emory. It is reasonable for me to believe that, being a monk and an Emory student at the same time, he must has both a rich mundane life and a rich spiritual life.
We met each other on the first floor of Math and Science Building. After greeting each other, I quickly went to the topic.
"So before our interview, would you mind just briefly tell me about your history with Tibetan Buddhism and its meditation?"
"Unnn.... I jointed monastery when I was 14, so it has been 20 years since I became a monk. But one thing is that, I have not been a good monk, and my experience of meditation may not be that good. After joining the monastery, I started studying Tibetan Buddhism philosophy and Tibetan literature. And 6 years after, I personally started to meditate. I have really been seriously meditating for, say, the past 10 years." Sonam's personal story sounds very intriguing to me, and it made me want to know more about monks' life at monastery.
"So is it a common thing in Tibetan tradition that monks only start to meditate after they jointed monasteries for some years?"
"Well.........., ideally we should start meditation at the very beginning together with the study of philosophy," Sonam seemed to hesitate about the answer of this question," but practically, the monasteries, especially my monastery, focus more on the study of literature and philosophy at the beginning. And it is true that monks generally start to meditate after several years." I guess I was still curious about monks' life, so although it is pretty tangential to my project ,I started another question.
"Did you do any other practices in the monastery?"
"Oh, sure," this question did not trouble Sonam at all,"for example. we gather together to read Sutras and prayers for about 4 or 5 times a week. Besides, the most important of our activities is the debate section. It is different for different monasteries......, but, in my monastery, debate is considered a critical part, since we believe that through debate we can understand Buddhism philosophy better. We usually debate in the morning for 3 hours, and in the evening we debate again." I was really shocked, although having been to Tibet once,I was still ignorant about the fact that debate can be that significant to their life.
I believed that I had asked enough questions about monk life, so I turned to the topic of spiritual experience.
"Have you had any peak experiences during meditation?"
"I haven't had any of those extraordinary experiences, but I personally know many people who have had it. Some of them went through many years of practice, and, suddenly this kind of insight came. But not for me, I haven't had one........" I did not know whether I have asked the proper question, since the fact that he could not meet my "expectation" may disappoint him.
However, Sonam appeared to be clam and undisturbed, and I was relived to know that he wasn't sad. "........However, personally, for someone who has been meditating for years like me, I feel.....well...I feel I am a little bit calmer. Actually, I want to tell one of my personal stories, do you want to hear?"
"Sure!" I replied, wondering what story he was going to tell.
"Okay, so when I was in monastery, I got a letter telling me that me father passed away. At the beginning, I was really really sad, since I haven't seen him for about 7 or 8 years, and, he passed away. Then, I started to realize that nothing remains permanent, and I felt better. I guess it was the Buddhism philosophy and my meditation experience that helped me get over."
I don't know what to say. I didn't expect such a sad story, so I just said "I am really sorry," and there was a long silence between us.
Finally, it was me who broke this silence. I told him my case study, and asked him what does he think about Jie's story.
"Well, traditionally, in Tibetan Buddhism practitioners try to get away from the community and practice in mountains or hermitages. But nowadays, .....you know Da Lai La Ma, he has told us to come out of the mountain and live in the community, since he believe that it is those people in the community that really need help. You know, help with relationships, questions regarding life and death ,and so on. That's why he encourages practitioners to walk out of the mountain in order to help people. And personally, I also believe it is more important to be in the community. After all, we are social animals, aren't we?"
His answer was good, but I wanted to know more of his personal opinion on this case, so I asked another challenging question.
"So...what you said is mainly on the understanding level. What if one just feels the transiency of life, and wants to stay in the mountain in order to seek the ultimate goal, Nirvana?"
"Ennnnnn......., actually, it makes sense, since in the mountains they do not need to deal with the complexity of life and could focus solely on their spiritual practice. But, you know, what I think is that we can still achieve the state of Nirvana, or any other ultimate goal when we practice in the community. I don't believe the difference is large enough to make practicing in a mountain the only way."
"So what you are saying is we can reconcile spiritual practice and other daily activities?"
"Exactly! You can work in the community, maintain connections with other people as well as keep your practice."
We finally reached mutual agreement, but I still wasn't satisfied enough, so I decided to relate my previous question with his personal experience.
"So another question is have you ever seen anyone who has this kind of difficulty? I mean, the difficulty to coordinate their daily life and spiritual practice."
"Oh, yeah. YEAH, actually I know many people. As a monk, I live in a monastery, and you know, we keep vows (not killing, not drinking alcohol, not have relationship with women, etc.), and sometimes people leave monasteries because they don't want to keep their vows. The most frequent case is when someone fall in love with a woman. Also, there are also times when people just leave for no particular reason. They just don't like the life in the monastery. But for me, those vows are also part of my practice, so I keep them." I have to admire Sonam's persistence. After all ,keeping those vows for more than 20 years isn't an easy thing for anyone.
"So, the last question, if you were asked to say one most important benefit of meditation to ordinary people, what would you say?"
"Well, I believe for everyone, if you practice meditation, you will become calmer and more peaceful. And, you know, when you face some big problems in your life, like what I have faced, meditation will help you cope with them in a better way. Also ,the most important thing is, meditation makes you a happy person. What can be more important than that?"
We met each other on the first floor of Math and Science Building. After greeting each other, I quickly went to the topic.
"So before our interview, would you mind just briefly tell me about your history with Tibetan Buddhism and its meditation?"
"Unnn.... I jointed monastery when I was 14, so it has been 20 years since I became a monk. But one thing is that, I have not been a good monk, and my experience of meditation may not be that good. After joining the monastery, I started studying Tibetan Buddhism philosophy and Tibetan literature. And 6 years after, I personally started to meditate. I have really been seriously meditating for, say, the past 10 years." Sonam's personal story sounds very intriguing to me, and it made me want to know more about monks' life at monastery.
"So is it a common thing in Tibetan tradition that monks only start to meditate after they jointed monasteries for some years?"
"Well.........., ideally we should start meditation at the very beginning together with the study of philosophy," Sonam seemed to hesitate about the answer of this question," but practically, the monasteries, especially my monastery, focus more on the study of literature and philosophy at the beginning. And it is true that monks generally start to meditate after several years." I guess I was still curious about monks' life, so although it is pretty tangential to my project ,I started another question.
"Did you do any other practices in the monastery?"
"Oh, sure," this question did not trouble Sonam at all,"for example. we gather together to read Sutras and prayers for about 4 or 5 times a week. Besides, the most important of our activities is the debate section. It is different for different monasteries......, but, in my monastery, debate is considered a critical part, since we believe that through debate we can understand Buddhism philosophy better. We usually debate in the morning for 3 hours, and in the evening we debate again." I was really shocked, although having been to Tibet once,I was still ignorant about the fact that debate can be that significant to their life.
I believed that I had asked enough questions about monk life, so I turned to the topic of spiritual experience.
"Have you had any peak experiences during meditation?"
"I haven't had any of those extraordinary experiences, but I personally know many people who have had it. Some of them went through many years of practice, and, suddenly this kind of insight came. But not for me, I haven't had one........" I did not know whether I have asked the proper question, since the fact that he could not meet my "expectation" may disappoint him.
However, Sonam appeared to be clam and undisturbed, and I was relived to know that he wasn't sad. "........However, personally, for someone who has been meditating for years like me, I feel.....well...I feel I am a little bit calmer. Actually, I want to tell one of my personal stories, do you want to hear?"
"Sure!" I replied, wondering what story he was going to tell.
"Okay, so when I was in monastery, I got a letter telling me that me father passed away. At the beginning, I was really really sad, since I haven't seen him for about 7 or 8 years, and, he passed away. Then, I started to realize that nothing remains permanent, and I felt better. I guess it was the Buddhism philosophy and my meditation experience that helped me get over."
I don't know what to say. I didn't expect such a sad story, so I just said "I am really sorry," and there was a long silence between us.
Finally, it was me who broke this silence. I told him my case study, and asked him what does he think about Jie's story.
"Well, traditionally, in Tibetan Buddhism practitioners try to get away from the community and practice in mountains or hermitages. But nowadays, .....you know Da Lai La Ma, he has told us to come out of the mountain and live in the community, since he believe that it is those people in the community that really need help. You know, help with relationships, questions regarding life and death ,and so on. That's why he encourages practitioners to walk out of the mountain in order to help people. And personally, I also believe it is more important to be in the community. After all, we are social animals, aren't we?"
His answer was good, but I wanted to know more of his personal opinion on this case, so I asked another challenging question.
"So...what you said is mainly on the understanding level. What if one just feels the transiency of life, and wants to stay in the mountain in order to seek the ultimate goal, Nirvana?"
"Ennnnnn......., actually, it makes sense, since in the mountains they do not need to deal with the complexity of life and could focus solely on their spiritual practice. But, you know, what I think is that we can still achieve the state of Nirvana, or any other ultimate goal when we practice in the community. I don't believe the difference is large enough to make practicing in a mountain the only way."
"So what you are saying is we can reconcile spiritual practice and other daily activities?"
"Exactly! You can work in the community, maintain connections with other people as well as keep your practice."
We finally reached mutual agreement, but I still wasn't satisfied enough, so I decided to relate my previous question with his personal experience.
"So another question is have you ever seen anyone who has this kind of difficulty? I mean, the difficulty to coordinate their daily life and spiritual practice."
"Oh, yeah. YEAH, actually I know many people. As a monk, I live in a monastery, and you know, we keep vows (not killing, not drinking alcohol, not have relationship with women, etc.), and sometimes people leave monasteries because they don't want to keep their vows. The most frequent case is when someone fall in love with a woman. Also, there are also times when people just leave for no particular reason. They just don't like the life in the monastery. But for me, those vows are also part of my practice, so I keep them." I have to admire Sonam's persistence. After all ,keeping those vows for more than 20 years isn't an easy thing for anyone.
"So, the last question, if you were asked to say one most important benefit of meditation to ordinary people, what would you say?"
"Well, I believe for everyone, if you practice meditation, you will become calmer and more peaceful. And, you know, when you face some big problems in your life, like what I have faced, meditation will help you cope with them in a better way. Also ,the most important thing is, meditation makes you a happy person. What can be more important than that?"